“I don’t think social anxiety anymore. It’s just not even something that… I don’t feel twisted like a pretzel. If I want something, I’m like, oh, I might eat this. I go wherever I need to go to get it. Oh, I want to go to this cafe might eat this lunch with these people.

I’m totally fine going to the counter asking for what I want.

And I don’t even think or I better not talk so much. I don’t engage that person even more. It’s just like, I just go with the flow.

And for the last Christmas, I hosted Christmas for 18 people. And yeah, so I did it myself.

I didn’t hide behind anyone. Two years ago, I couldn’t even go out into the lounge to be with, in Christmas.”

All right, that very exciting description of social ease that you just heard is from Kate, who you’re about to hear an interview of, or who you about to see an interview with. Depending on whether you’re listening to this podcast already seen this on video on my YouTube channel is youtube.com/sebastiaandoc

Just as a little bit of a pre-frame to the interview, we talked about a that is no longer running, that ran from 2018 to 2019.

Then I took a year to regroup, see how I could improve things.

And then I actually plan to do Social Confidence Community 2.0 in August of this year, but I moved it earlier to May. And I renamed it to the Social Confidence Club.

That’s what we’ve been running, it’s been a huge success. Much better even than the social confidence community that we’re talking about, but it’s close for registration, but it will be opening up in 2021.

But first, we got the 30 days social confidence challenge coming up, which is super exciting.

And I’m releasing this interview right now. So, you get a bit of an idea of what might be possible when you actually start working on the crap that’s in the way of your social ease.

So without further ado, I hope you enjoy my interview with Kate. Here we go.

—

Seb: Hello! Welcome!

My name is Sebastiaan van der Schrier from social-anxiety-solutions.com.

I am a former Social Anxiety Disorder sufferer and a Social Confidence Coach.

I help people feel calm, relaxed, and at ease in social situations. I’ve been doing that for a long time.

In July or August 2018, I started an online Social Confidence Community – the first ever that I’ve known off, and the first-ever that I’ve definitely run.

We ran it for roughly a year, and it was a big success. A lot of people are staying on and reporting profound results.

One of these people is the lady that we’re speaking with today – Kate.

Thank you very much for being on the call.

Kate: That’s okay.

Seb: I’m going to ask you some really well-prepared questions that I mostly found online. But, basically, it’s a bit of a casual conversation.

I always first want to know what it was like before everything.

Because people can relate to the pain of what was happening there easily – that’s instant.

The actual changes?

That’s a bit harder for people to grasp, especially if you instantly start talking about that.

So, we’ll go into what it was like before, then the community’s experience: What you liked? What didn’t you like? What was easy? What was difficult? And then actual results.

What was it like for you prior to community, Social Anxiety wise?

Kate: I’ve probably been struggling with Social Anxiety – on and off since probably my late teens when it was getting quite debilitating.

And then, I had periods in my life where I wasn’t. I could function.

But there was always just a feeling of it lurking in the background like I would not do certain things.

And so, I just kind of white-knuckled everything, even though I knew healing and different techniques. This was an area I just couldn’t overcome.

I just couldn’t.

I tried so many things.

I’ve written just a few things down – how it was for me, right before I went into, we started the course.

• I stopped driving in public; I couldn’t handle being out.

There were other shoes as well, because of the earthquakes where I lived. But the social anxiety was part of it. So, I couldn’t drive, I couldn’t handle being in traffic. But felt like there were people around me.

• I couldn’t go into shops and ask for things.

Maybe if I could go into shops, there’s no way I could get to the counter. And I was terrified of paying for the things. Because since I’d last been in shops, all the POS machine things where you had to pay had all changed.

And I was like, “Oh, my God, I don’t know how to use these new ones. And I don’t want to have to spend that time there, feeling in the spotlight, like, I don’t want to ask or say anything.

• I couldn’t go to restaurants or cafes and do anything socially.

I hated sitting at a table, even in a house.

• I couldn’t go to the supermarket. 

I couldn’t handle the amount of people in the supermarket. 

• I couldn’t do things like take a class online.

I was okay if it was just typing and chat rooms and stuff, but not visual. No camera.

I was pretty debilitated, really.

If I wanted something, I would buy it online, and I wouldn’t have the option of, “Oh, God, I won’t eat this, I’ll go get it.”

It’s like a hit. I felt like I was twisted like a pretzel to get anything that I wanted.

I also felt quite dependent on the people around me to do some of those things that I need to get done.

I felt really debilitated.

Seb: How did you feel when you were in a social situation?

Kate: I avoided them.

Like Christmas Day, I would just be sick on Christmas Day. Or I just couldn’t handle a room of people; I could just handle my small world.

I couldn’t go to other people’s houses. And I was just terrified of any interaction.

And I think I’ve had periods of times in my life where I was fine.

So, I knew that I could be fine. But then that made me feel like, “Oh, my God, what’s wrong with me?” I just kind of get back to how I used to be.

Seb: And in situations that you couldn’t avoid, because when that socializing is going to be painful and awkward or uncomfortable and so on. It’s very common to then avoid those situations, right? Because why would I feel like this? When we can stay at home and don’t feel like that?

Kate: Yeah!

Seb: Sometimes, there are unexpected things or spontaneous things, or someone comes over, or what would you then be like? Or what would you then feel like?

Kate: I lived in a house with other people. So, I would just avoid answering the door. Or if there were visitors or something, I would just try not to be around them.

And if I had to engage in sight, I might be able to stand there, but I’d be frozen.

I just feel like, “I just want to leave, I want to leave. I’ve got to get out of here.”

I couldn’t be in the conversation easily. Because my whole thought process was, “I just want to leave, I’ve just got to get out”.

I might be able to look like I’m replying. But inside of me, I was just going through the motions.

Seb: They’re not present, not connected.

Kate: Definitely not connected. And I’m just kind of like hanging on until I could actually just leave.

Seb: And you say frozen, which is a common experience for people.

How did you feel? What emotions would you feel? Were you worried? Were you afraid?

Kate: It was like, fight-flight. Really.

If I look back on it, it’s the freeze part of fight-flight.

But it’s fear. It’s all the time fear and feeling hyper-vigilant.

And also, almost going into survival mode, really and feeling like that person’s a threat. So, my whole system almost quite locked on to looking at that person. And as if there was where a threat.

And definitely, no connection and not connected to myself, either.

Seb: Do you remember some of the worries or fears you had in the conversation or when you were in that moment?

Kate: Well, it was always a running commentary in my head of how much of a loser I felt that I was. “Oh, my God, I’m such a loser. I can’t even do the simple thing.”

And there was a fear of being seen, to be afraid, or there was a fear of judgment, I think to like, what I might say, or how I might say it – I feared that I would be judged.

So, the whole time it was super, supercritical of what I was saying in return. And never seen the other person as maybe being uncomfortable, or awkward or whatever.

I just put them kind of saw them as far more confident than I am. So, they’re there must be fine.

So, just always feeling like I was a loser.

I think feeling like I was such a loser was a big one for me.

And I didn’t have a fear of being seen to be read or anything like that.

I felt as if I was being judged. Or I was being assessed.

Seb: Assessed as in like evaluated?

Kate: Yeah, yeah. And I’d always think that they probably thought I was a loser, as well.

Seb: Hmm. Gotcha. Right. Okay. Eventually, we started working with the community, but prior to that, I put information out there I tried to get people to sign up.; I’m trying to convince people that “Hey, this is not a bunch of nonsense. This actually works.”

Do you remember any doubts that you had that could have prevented you from actually pulling the trigger and moving forward?

Kate: I don’t really think so. Because usually, when I decide, I want to do something, I just do it.

So, I think I probably had a fear that you would take me too far out of my depth, or you move at a pace that would be too fast for me, and then it ended up being a loser, like, “Oh, my God, I can’t. I’m failing again.”

And I had a fear that perhaps you might tell me to go into situations and do what it takes. I just didn’t want to do that, like, cognitive behavior therapy, but you’re doing EFT.

I didn’t want to be out of my depth.

Seb: Huh. Okay. That’s insightful. Good to know.

All right. And then, let me look at my questions.

Kate: I’m just thinking one thing that I haven’t said, was a big part of having social anxiety is feeling like as your life’s ticking along, you’re just missing out on so many things. And I kind of justified it by thinking, “oh, well, I’m really interested in healing and personal growth and stuff.”

And then my son got married in Rarotonga, and I couldn’t go.

And that just completely threw me off the deep end.

That’s when I really got serious, like, I’ve got to sort this.

I’ve missed out on a major event in my kid’s life. And that was just way too much.

That gave me the impetus to kind of, I’m going to do what it takes.

Seb: My mentor says that pain is a very good motivator.

Kate: Yeah.

Seb: And you mentioned that you tried a bunch of things to no avail. What were the things that you tried?

Kate: I did cognitive behavior therapy for this. And she did things like, talk me into wanting me to walk into cafes and sit down and have a coffee, and we went to the library and…

Seb: This was with a therapist?

Kate: Yeah. We kind of it was like exposure stuff, and she took me places. Like, we went to the park, and I just felt like it made me worse.

It was just I felt more re-traumatized.

I couldn’t go to the cafe – there was just way too much.

And so, in the end, it just made me feel like a total loser or, I had one of those cases that couldn’t be like what we talked about. I was the hardest case.

Seb: A belief that most people tend to have. Especially once they show up and start doing some tapping because they tried a whole bunch of the other things already, and that didn’t work. And like, “well, clearly, I must be broken in there.”

So, I’m a tough case, and nothing works for me.

Kate: Yeah. And I also remember I wanted to have sessions with you personally, and you interviewed me. And then you decided, “No, you didn’t want to work with me.” And you referred me to someone else.

And I was like, “Oh, my God. I’m such a case. I’m, I’m too difficult for him.”

So, there, I just felt like, “Oh, my God, I’m the toughest case.”

Seb: Well, a good thing, I was wrong.

And I think we want to go into what the actual community was like?

So, I guess, what was your initial experience the first month or so?

Kate: I loved it!

I just felt right at home. This is my pack. This is my tribe.

It was so good to be around people who had the same issue as me.

I felt like we could all just share everything. And now one is judging us, and it was really, really good. I loved it.

Seb: I found that to be the case as well. It was very interesting how everyone really connects because finally, the secret is out. It’s on the table. We are all here on the same plate.

Kate: And also, just kind of realizing how many people experience this. And everyone’s kind of normal. It’s not just how common it is.

Seb: Yeah. It’s like 12% of the Western people population prevalence in the life span. And that’s what the statistics that they’ve measured.

Now, they have not measured all the people that do not reach out to a therapist because they’re scared of it.

So, my computation is way, way higher. But at the very least, it’s that 12%. There are lots and lots of people dealing with this problem.

And it’s very nice, indeed.

When you see someone that described what it is that you’re dealing with, you’re like, “Oh, my God, you’re not alone in this.”

Kate: And it gave me the courage to face more. I went for what I wanted and tried things, and I felt like I could try something new. And it was like, “Oh, my gosh, I can go and tell everyone.”

It did feel like it was the support I needed.

Seb: Great! Because since you don’t know what the community actually was, let’s say a bit about that.

So, it consisted of:

1. Drip fed content.

Specific lessons to learn about your psychology, mental, emotional well-being, and tapping, and specifically how to apply tapping to overcome Social Anxiety.

It was ten modules that I took them through. And within those modules, there were particular lessons. And that was one component of the community.

2. An online forum.

3. Live webinars every week.

And Kate was actually the second volunteer that I worked with, and this is kind of funny.

So, I kicked off the community by saying in my marketing to promote the community; it’s going to be these three components.

But I didn’t have any volunteers ahead of time. I just assumed, “yeah, people are going to volunteer, of course, they’re going to volunteer, why wouldn’t they?”

And I’ll know how to communicate in such a way that they’ll be jumping on the opportunity.

And I send out my little persuasion emails trying to get people to jump on a live webinar so that I could coach them. And it was crickets.

Nobody volunteered.

I’m like, “Oh, no, this is not good.”

And then someone contacted me; his name is Nathan. And I had already closed the community. And he said, “Man, can I still get in?”

I’m like, “You can’t really get in. But how motivated are you to overcome your social anxiety?”

He’s like, “I am totally motivated!”

And I’m like, “Great! I’ve got a live webinar coming up, and I’ll coach you for free. And there you go.”

And he said yes to it. So, he became the first volunteer to be coached on the live webinar.

And then people saw that he was making a transformation.

Well, actually, rather than me telling his story.

You didn’t volunteer for the first one, but you volunteered for the second one. So, what motivated you to do that? And how did you feel? Were you scared? What was your experience during the coaching and during the webinar?

Kate: My thing is, I felt like, “well, here I am, I’ve got this guy, who’s coaching on social anxiety, I’ve got to get some work done on me, I’m going to volunteer.”

Then, “I’ve got to make this work, I’ve got to do the work. And I’m not going to; it’s not going to happen if I don’t show up.”

My goal was, I am just going to show up.

And that I remember that first. Webinar, I was terrified. It was like, and I was frozen.

I just basically sit there all day, trying to keep it together.

Seb: I’ve never had that experience myself because nobody specialized in social anxiety coaching. I’ve seen a lot of therapists. But I wasn’t necessarily, especially back in the day, specifically for social anxiety.

Especially not in a webinar kind of format, where people are watching you with that kind of stuff.

It’s creating a social anxiety scenario, but the big difference is the people who are watching all have social anxiety.

And it’s kind of like we’re all in this together.

And the first thing that I did is like, Okay, how are you feeling?

“Well, I’m frozen.”

Okay, great.

So now that the secret is out, and we can work with the feelings there.

The big difference is now you’re not in a social situation. And you got to pretend that you’re okay. And all that knows your actual problem is right there.

Kate: What I really loved about your method is, I knew that we could just tap on it instantly. As soon as I knew that we weren’t going to talk about stuff, and I knew I would go straight for the tapping. So that kind of gave me the confidence as well, that we’re going to tack my fear down before we start.

Seb: Yup. And then, after that, we had a whole bunch of webinars with a whole bunch of people. So, the floodgates were opened, which was good.

Let’s see.

What else did you like about the webinars when you were not being coached, but you were just watching and typing along?

Kate: I mean, by that stage, we kind of all also really gotten to know each other in the forum. So, it was really nice to put a face to a name and there was always something and everybody I could relate to. Like in the other shows, it may have been different, but it was always the same.

I could just tap along and have relief by tapping on their issues.

Seb: Spectacular, isn’t it? I love that concept so much.

Kate: Yeah, right.

Seb: And especially with social anxiety because, yes, everyone has a unique person, they have a unique history. But the problems, pretty much everyone feels on some level, they’re not good enough.

Not a lot of people feel that people don’t like them.

A lot of people are afraid of being seen as anxious.

A lot of people are afraid of being judged negatively.

And so, the presenting problem of social anxieties is very similar and the same.

And while the root causes might be different, as we tap on the symptoms and everything, and I would tap with the people on the actual causes.

Still, your brain links it to whatever’s going on with you.

Kate: Yeah, totally.

Seb: I might be working with this girl on her relationship with her mom, being critical. And that reminds you of your dad, being critical. For example, your brain just goes there, and the tapping releases it anyway.

Kate: Yeah, it’s great.

Seb: Awesome! And while this is an interview, For people to understand what the community was like, because I think I’m going to run another one at some point.

But I want to do things a little bit differently.

I also want to know what did you not like about it? Or what was difficult about it? What I could improve next time, I might cut this out?

Kate: I think the only thing that I didn’t like was everybody just faded away on the forum.

My sense was, I could be totally wrong. But everybody got to a point where they kind of felt way too challenged.

And they didn’t want to do anymore.

So, being in the forum kind of triggered it up.

So, they just didn’t even hang out in the forum either.

So, it was like, everybody kind of had their sticking point. And then they faded away.

Maybe next time? I don’t know. We could have one because you could do a group chat on zoom or something. But then, some people are just scared of showing up.

So, you could maybe do some exploring around there, how to keep people.

But then, that is controlling. People are just going to fade out when I mean this is just life.

Seb: That was a good question. Because I thought about this as well, and because I think the forum was active for the first 4 – 6 months. And then it started to fade.

And I was thinking maybe even because people had gotten enough out of the forum, and there were connections made, and feelings were shared.

And so, I was also thinking:

For one, what you said there might be an overwhelming of information.

For two, it might be they’ve gotten the value out of it, and now it would become something additional to attend to.

And there probably needs to be more people anyway in the forum.

The next time I’m running it, I aim to get a lot more people and spread out the information and spread out the content so that it’s less.

In the end, we had about 75% of the people that stayed until the end. So that’s a good percentage, in general, for people that run communities, it’s unheard of.

Kate: I just didn’t see anyone on the forum.

I just committed to showing up. That was my whole goal.

So, it was like, after a while, I felt like I was showing up. There was an echo in the room.

Seb: Right, exactly! Anyone out there out there? (echoing)

What else did you like about the forum? Or let me be more specific. What were three other things you liked about the community?

Kate: I like the structure. I like the healings of each module and what you expected from us to talk about? I don’t know what else.

Seb: Let me change my question. Because I messed it up. I should have asked a different question first.

What did you like the most about the community?

Kate: Well, it’s quite funny. Because I wouldn’t have said this in the beginning. But what I liked was I liked interacting with people.

So it was being there with the people and getting to know everyone. Which, I wouldn’t have said that. In the beginning, I would have just said it somewhere where I can talk about myself, but then, by the end, it was like, we were, as everybody I want to interact with these people that I’ve got to know.

Seb: Mm-hmm. Okay. Cool. All right. Now, let’s talk about the actual results.

How are things now compared to how they were before the community?

Kate: That just completely different. It’s just like, I don’t think social anxiety anymore. It’s just not even something that… I don’t feel twisted like a pretzel. If I want something, I’m like, oh, I might eat this form. I go wherever I need to go to get it. Oh, I want to go to this cafe might eat this lunch with these people.

I’m totally fine going to the counter asking for what I want.

And I don’t even think or I better not talk so much. I don’t engage that person even more. It’s just like, I just go with the flow.

And for the last Christmas, I hosted Christmas for 18 people. And yeah, so I did it myself.

I didn’t hide behind anyone. Two years ago, I couldn’t even go out into the lounge to be within Christmas.

I’m totally fine sitting at the table.

I drive everywhere, on the motorway. Drive wherever you want.

I just don’t avoid people.

I don’t avoid conversations.

And I also really enjoy being around people, like, social situations are a motivation for me now.

Seb: Excellent. Great.

Kate: And I think the other thing too, is the biggest thing that I felt before was I had all these regrets of things that I missed out on.

But the biggest thing that I noticed is, I don’t feel like I missed out on anything.

Now that I’m through it. I feel like I’ve always been this way, like, I’m not missing out, there isn’t a sense of disconnection. And, it just feels like I’m connected. And I can have all those experiences that I want.

And it almost feels like I didn’t have them.

I just feel like I’ve always been this way.

Seb: It sounds like it’s not that big of a deal.

Kate: I also have attended a few classes online, where I’m in a group and everyone’s faces on the screen, and we’re all talking, and I have one on one sessions. And I just feel like I’m doing the things that I want to do for the reasons I want to do them.

And I can be involved in the conversation about that thing. I haven’t got any self-talk going on about myself. It’s not so loud that I can’t be present.

So, if I’m, if I go somewhere, and I’m talking about a dog, I’m just talking about a dog. I can be in the conversation.

Seb: Hmm. You do not have an extra conversation at the same time, like, “oh, should I be talking about this dog? Or what are they going to say?”

Kate: What am I look like when I’m talking about this dog? Or, or sit the wrong thing? I can just don’t care.

I don’t. Like, when I miss up and stuff, and I still have moments of like, normal moments,

but I just don’t have it. I’m just, I just feel natural.

Seb: Mm-hmm. Good.

Kate: I mean, there are still things that I want to do that I haven’t done. But it’s, I don’t feel as if I need to go testing myself, to see if I can do them because I’m just doing the things that I want to do now, and it’s like if I want to go and do something else later that I think, Oh, I haven’t done this socially. I might think, oh, gosh, that’s maybe something I haven’t tried. But it just feels as if that’s what everybody would feel, going into a new situation, I don’t think, or I’m an except I’m going to feel bad because I’ve got social anxiety, or I had it. It just feels like, oh, this is a new thing. Good. Yes.

Seb: Yes. Very healthy perspective.

I like how you’re describing it because that’s also how I describe it and how I’ve described it in the past.

Like, I write one email that I, that people kind of get automatically. And I talk about, where a client asked me so what does it feel like social confidence? Right? Well, it just feels like not being anxious, being in the moment, and enjoying the conversation. And there’s, it’s not a big deal. It just seems like a really big, insurmountable, fantastic, wonderful thing when you’re super anxious.

Kate: And it feels like there’s this huge kind of chasm and that you can’t get to the other side, what, you’re going to need extra abilities or something.

But I mean, going through the process, and the community in the modules is, for me, was just so profound, and it was such a life-changing.

I was talking to my son today about how as I was coming to talk to you. And he is like, “Oh, my God, mom.  You’re so different to how you used to be,”

I know, my family’s relieved.

My parents are excited and relieved that I’m doing all those things that they really would have wanted me to do.

And I suppose the other thing I realized is that they’re quite elderly now. So there would have been a part of them worrying that I wasn’t coping with life. And what would happen if they weren’t there?

And so now, they’re just so happy. They can go out for a meal with me and do all those things that I’ve never been asked to do all of my adult life.

Seb: Brilliant. Nice work. Well, you put in the work, you get the results.

Because you were one of the troopers and one of the people that were actually there putting in the work showing up for webinars. Yeah. So great.

And what I also want to say is, like, that belief that, hey, I can do this, and I will overcome this. That wasn’t there in the was in the start, was it?

Kate:  No way. I, I just felt like, I’m such a hard case, you’re not going to be able to correct me and even though I really wanted to, yeah. Yeah. It’s, it was just so thrilling to hit success after success.

Like, “Oh, my God, I just did that. I’m so proud.”

When I was driving on the motorway the other day, I was saying, God,  I just couldn’t even handle doing this once upon a time. And, being around all those other people and stuff. It was like, look at me; it’s some great feeling.

Seb: Yeah. Freedom. And that’s also why this community ran for a year, because you start somewhere, and you’ve been socially anxious for a long time.

The youngest person in the community was of adult age, but I think 19 or something. And then, even that person already had a history of almost a decade of social anxiety. And let’s just say more decade, you had more damn experience with social anxiety. So it’s been programming your mind for a long time. And people, we’re living in this society where we want everything quickly. We want everything, I want goals. Now, I want to stop suffering. I want to take a pill, and I want to be done with this. But it’s not how it works.

It’s going to take time to restructure everything, and even just building up that belief that, wow, I really can’t change. That takes time. Because you get pieces and pieces of evidence that, indeed, you are changing. But there’s a lot of things involved in it. That’s why it’s a process over time.

Kate: Yeah. And also, the other thing that I used to often experience was, I would change,

but then it wouldn’t last.

Because I was just trying to putting all my effort and will into something, I’m going to do this. And, and then fuel. I did it.

And it just took so much energy.

But I really, in the beginning, I really couldn’t see how I was going I felt like I was here, and how was I going it? I couldn’t imagine that I would ever be there.

And it would mean that I’d have to change so much in order to do it. And I didn’t know whether I wanted to change that much.

I just didn’t know whether I had it in me to change. It just wasn’t like that at all. It just is like; it’s still me. I’m just, I just got there. And it was so much. It really was so much easier than I thought it was going to be.

Seb: And I was saying, I’m still me.

Yeah, you’re not turning into someone else.

That’s the thing people think of change means I’ve got to go be someone else.

I got to be an extroverted person.

Now we’re going to talk to people all the time, or I’m going to be confident and spotlight all the time.

Kate: It’s just slack. I’m still the person I was. I just not got all this fear and Need to avoid everything?

Seb: And I think a theme that runs throughout the community is compassion and acceptance.

So compassion for the struggle that you’re dealing with, and acceptance of what you’re dealing with, as well as accepting all sides of you.

Yeah, bad and the ugly. Yeah.

Kate: That was a big breakthrough. When I could actually, it’s a paradox that really isn’t a bet you can accept how you are but still wanting to change. But that was a huge breakthrough when I could accept that this is how I, this is how I am.

Seb: Hmm. Are there any more breakthroughs that you remember along the way?

Kate: I think one of the other biggest things that made a profound change, and the difference was when I accepted that I had a lot of resistance.

Like dealing with resistance,

I didn’t fully understand what resistance was.

I just kind of felt ashamed that I maybe didn’t want to do something.

How can I say I want to be socially anxious, when deep down, I really don’t want I really want to stay at home, and I don’t want to go and do that thing.

It’s like, of course, I want to go and do that thing. Of course, I want to get better.

But deep down, I really didn’t want to. Yeah. And it, it was, it was just, I mean, I remember some of the first webinars, you’d get me to tap on some of the things that I didn’t want to tap on it, because it was like, I just, I couldn’t accept that I had all this resistance.

Seb: Yeah. And for people watching, resistance is like, so consciously, that the mind that you make decisions with plans with, etc., that’s your conscious mind. So consciously, yes, that social anxiety sucks, you don’t want to deal with it. And you want it to stop, and you want to feel at ease.

But there’s a deeper part of your mind, your subconscious mind. And that part is saying, No, it’s not safe for you to be at ease. Because if you’re at ease, then fill in the blank, then you’ll get criticized like you did when you were little, you’re dead, or then you’ll be humiliated.

Because whatever. And then people won’t like you, because your mom didn’t like you or whatever, whatever it is, like it learned that being yourself feeling at ease, saying whatever comes to mind all that that that’s not safe. And so yes, consciously, you want to stop the anxiety, you want to feel at ease,

But subconsciously, it’s, it’s a no because it thinks that’s going to be dangerous because you’re going to get rejected, you’re going to get hurt.

The subconscious believes that your anxiety needs to be there to protect you to warn you away from all these potential harms and painful experiences that you can have.

And so you want to get rid of your social anxiety. But your subconscious, which has met has the main job; your protection is saying no. So you’re going forward and backward and forward and backward.

What I hear you say is like, once I accepted, that was indeed the case. That was when I,

Kate: That really made a huge difference. For me. That’s when I could really start to do things.

And that’s when it was more natural, I think.

And I had to decide to do things.

Seb: Yeah. Yeah. And it’s also, again, an acceptance. Hmm.

So you accept that part of you, trying to protect you, and even though it might not make logical sense to you, you accept that, hey, some part of me really doesn’t want to go to that party.

Or some part of me really doesn’t want to do this work to overcome my social anxiety. Because it’s, it thinks it’s better to stay where I’m at. The whole first module I think that we ran it for about six weeks, was focused on acceptance, acceptance, where we’re at the acceptance of the anxiety acceptance of what we’re dealing with.

Kate: The way you structured your modules and the way they came one after the other, that was, that was profound for me because it was stuff that I like I’ve been into personal growth for decades, and it was just stuff that I just didn’t know.

And it really made a profound difference.

Seb: Awesome. Well, I’m near the final question. Would you recommend the community? If so, why?

Kate: Totally, totally, totally recommend it.

Seb: Good. Good.

Kate: It’s like, changed my life I really did.

And a few of the techniques that you taught us in the course, as well and talked about, have changed my life as well that I’ve carried on to do.

Seb: Yeah, yeah. Awesome.

And what I wanted to say is what would you if someone is deciding to go through the community? Because I might just show this at the beginning of the next one, what would be a piece of advice you would have for them?

Kate: I think the biggest thing that helped me was just to show up, just to decide you’re going to do it.

And, and I think the other thing is, just to put it out, put out there what’s happening for you,

I often used to feel like, Oh, my God, I’m just always asking questions or talking about stuff, or I’m always writing in the forum.

But it just keeps you going and keeps you moving forward. And just be prepared to do the work, I think, yeah.

Because at the end of the day, it’s such a short amount of time in your life. And it can have such a profound change.

Seb: Yeah, good advice. Be engaged and do the work.

Kate: Yeah, yeah. Just do it. I mean, times I was super, super scared. But it’s, you get through it, you’ll just get through it. I just don’t do the tapping.

Seb: I haven’t asked anyone to go outside and force themselves to ignite selves awkwardly, and none of that

Tapping, writing, watching webinars, and maybe making contact forms if you feel like it, which is highly recommended.

Because then you’re more engaged, and you’re more active, then you’re more participating.

Kate: And be honest, like, really be honest about where you’re at. Because, , you just have to move through it.

Seb: Great. Well, anything else you want to add?

Kate: I just want to say thank you to you again. If you really have changed my life,

Seb: My pleasure. Well, you did it yourself. But uh,

Kate: you, you Oh, my God.

Seb: I’m happy to have been. Thank you. Okay.

Well, on that note, thank you very much for doing this. This is going to help a whole bunch of people. Right?

Especially because it’s such an idea that you can overcome your social anxiety, can overcome your social anxiety. And we need to have a merging of traditional psychology and energy psychology. And I’m excited about this. This is cool.

Kate: And it’s also I mean, I just think it’s awesome that you’re doing this because it’s one thing to get over something.

But it’s another thing to kind of, to help other people get through it. Because I mean, you could have just decided, “Hey, I’m just going to carry on with my life now that I’m socially confident,” and it’s like, it’s like, you’ve just decided to kind of Yeah, I think it’s a really big thing to help other people get through it. Because it’s fast, it’s so debilitating. Hmm

Seb: Well, that felt very natural. Because also I was spending so much time on myself and therapists and that kind of stuff. This is what I have to do.

I’m enjoying it. So I’m very grateful that I get to do this.

In the end, it all works out, people.

Works out when you put in the work. That’s what it comes down to.

Anyway, thank you. This is inspiring for people.

And I’m going to sign off now because we could talk for ages. But thank you again, I inspiring journey.

We’ll be in touch.

—

All right, I hope you enjoyed this hope this inspires you.

This is in preparation, or in building anticipation and excitement for the 30-day social confidence challenge, which is really, really amazing.

In case. I haven’t convinced you by now. I’ve been promoting it for the past three months because it is so incredibly cool.

So, if you haven’t signed up for that yet, make sure that you do you register for that by going to https://bit.ly/socialconfidencechallenge and see you inside the challenge. Bye for now.

Oh, wait, no wait. Share this interview shared with other people, share it on forums, share with your friends, share with someone you care about who’s dealing with social anxiety. Okay, hope this helps you and I’ll connect with you soon and sign up for the free 30-day social confidence challenge by going to https://bit.ly/socialconfidencechallenge. Bye for now.

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